[DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

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[DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Zoran Regvart-2
Hi Cameleers,
we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
`org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.

My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.

What do you think?

zoran
--
Zoran Regvart
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Andrea Cosentino-3
I think it makes sense and we can do that for Camel 3.

+1.

Il giorno mer 12 giu 2019 alle ore 12:08 Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]>
ha scritto:

> Hi Cameleers,
> we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
>
> My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
>
> What do you think?
>
> zoran
> --
> Zoran Regvart
>
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Claus Ibsen-2
In reply to this post by Zoran Regvart-2
Hi

Well then we have camel-spring-boot itself, its not a starter should
it then also have that group id or not?
Today with org.apache.camel, then we know all of that is the official
Apache Camel.




On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Hi Cameleers,
> we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
>
> My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
>
> What do you think?
>
> zoran
> --
> Zoran Regvart



--
Claus Ibsen
-----------------
http://davsclaus.com @davsclaus
Camel in Action 2: https://www.manning.com/ibsen2
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

jbonofre
In reply to this post by Zoran Regvart-2
+1

Regards
JB

On 12/06/2019 12:08, Zoran Regvart wrote:

> Hi Cameleers,
> we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
>
> My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
>
> What do you think?
>
> zoran
>

--
Jean-Baptiste Onofré
[hidden email]
http://blog.nanthrax.net
Talend - http://www.talend.com
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

gnodet
In reply to this post by Claus Ibsen-2
Anything that starts with org.apache.xxx should be released by the
corresponding Apache project.
If that's not the case for Camel, we should ask the other projects to
change their groupId to something not starting with org.apache.camel.

Le mer. 12 juin 2019 à 12:24, Claus Ibsen <[hidden email]> a écrit :

> Hi
>
> Well then we have camel-spring-boot itself, its not a starter should
> it then also have that group id or not?
> Today with org.apache.camel, then we know all of that is the official
> Apache Camel.
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Cameleers,
> > we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> > `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> > another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
> >
> > My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> > even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> > information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> > this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> > exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > zoran
> > --
> > Zoran Regvart
>
>
>
> --
> Claus Ibsen
> -----------------
> http://davsclaus.com @davsclaus
> Camel in Action 2: https://www.manning.com/ibsen2
>


--
------------------------
Guillaume Nodet
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Andrea Cosentino-2
It's just a different package naming.. It's org.apache.camel.spring.boot

--
Andrea Cosentino 
----------------------------------
Apache Camel PMC Chair
Apache Karaf Committer
Apache Servicemix PMC Member
Email: [hidden email]
Twitter: @oscerd2
Github: oscerd






On Wednesday, June 12, 2019, 4:02:25 PM GMT+2, Guillaume Nodet <[hidden email]> wrote:





Anything that starts with org.apache.xxx should be released by the
corresponding Apache project.
If that's not the case for Camel, we should ask the other projects to
change their groupId to something not starting with org.apache.camel.

Le mer. 12 juin 2019 à 12:24, Claus Ibsen <[hidden email]> a écrit :

> Hi
>
> Well then we have camel-spring-boot itself, its not a starter should
> it then also have that group id or not?
> Today with org.apache.camel, then we know all of that is the official
> Apache Camel.
>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Cameleers,
> > we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> > `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> > another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
> >
> > My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> > even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> > information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> > this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> > exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > zoran
> > --
> > Zoran Regvart
>
>
>
> --
> Claus Ibsen
> -----------------
> http://davsclaus.com @davsclaus
> Camel in Action 2: https://www.manning.com/ibsen2

>


--
------------------------
Guillaume Nodet
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

gnodet
I was referring to the "Today with org.apache.camel, then we know all of
that is the official Apache Camel." sentence which implies that if the
groupId isn't org.apache.camel, it may not be official.  I slightly
disagree, as I think anything that *starts with* org.apache.camel is
supposed to be official so that would cover org.apache.camel.spring.boot or
anything similar.

Le mer. 12 juin 2019 à 16:11, Andrea Cosentino
<[hidden email]> a écrit :

> It's just a different package naming.. It's org.apache.camel.spring.boot
>
> --
> Andrea Cosentino
> ----------------------------------
> Apache Camel PMC Chair
> Apache Karaf Committer
> Apache Servicemix PMC Member
> Email: [hidden email]
> Twitter: @oscerd2
> Github: oscerd
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On Wednesday, June 12, 2019, 4:02:25 PM GMT+2, Guillaume Nodet <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
> Anything that starts with org.apache.xxx should be released by the
> corresponding Apache project.
> If that's not the case for Camel, we should ask the other projects to
> change their groupId to something not starting with org.apache.camel.
>
> Le mer. 12 juin 2019 à 12:24, Claus Ibsen <[hidden email]> a écrit
> :
>
> > Hi
> >
> > Well then we have camel-spring-boot itself, its not a starter should
> > it then also have that group id or not?
> > Today with org.apache.camel, then we know all of that is the official
> > Apache Camel.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi Cameleers,
> > > we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> > > `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> > > another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
> > >
> > > My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> > > even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> > > information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> > > this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> > > exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
> > >
> > > What do you think?
> > >
> > > zoran
> > > --
> > > Zoran Regvart
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Claus Ibsen
> > -----------------
> > http://davsclaus.com @davsclaus
> > Camel in Action 2: https://www.manning.com/ibsen2
>
> >
>
>
> --
> ------------------------
> Guillaume Nodet
>


--
------------------------
Guillaume Nodet
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Andrea Cosentino-3
Ah sorry, for the misunderstanding, yeah we're saying the same thing.

Il giorno mer 12 giu 2019 alle ore 16:32 Guillaume Nodet <[hidden email]>
ha scritto:

> I was referring to the "Today with org.apache.camel, then we know all of
> that is the official Apache Camel." sentence which implies that if the
> groupId isn't org.apache.camel, it may not be official.  I slightly
> disagree, as I think anything that *starts with* org.apache.camel is
> supposed to be official so that would cover org.apache.camel.spring.boot or
> anything similar.
>
> Le mer. 12 juin 2019 à 16:11, Andrea Cosentino
> <[hidden email]> a écrit :
>
> > It's just a different package naming.. It's org.apache.camel.spring.boot
> >
> > --
> > Andrea Cosentino
> > ----------------------------------
> > Apache Camel PMC Chair
> > Apache Karaf Committer
> > Apache Servicemix PMC Member
> > Email: [hidden email]
> > Twitter: @oscerd2
> > Github: oscerd
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Wednesday, June 12, 2019, 4:02:25 PM GMT+2, Guillaume Nodet <
> > [hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Anything that starts with org.apache.xxx should be released by the
> > corresponding Apache project.
> > If that's not the case for Camel, we should ask the other projects to
> > change their groupId to something not starting with org.apache.camel.
> >
> > Le mer. 12 juin 2019 à 12:24, Claus Ibsen <[hidden email]> a
> écrit
> > :
> >
> > > Hi
> > >
> > > Well then we have camel-spring-boot itself, its not a starter should
> > > it then also have that group id or not?
> > > Today with org.apache.camel, then we know all of that is the official
> > > Apache Camel.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]>
> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi Cameleers,
> > > > we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> > > > `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them
> with
> > > > another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
> > > >
> > > > My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of
> starters,
> > > > even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> > > > information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> > > > this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> > > > exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
> > > >
> > > > What do you think?
> > > >
> > > > zoran
> > > > --
> > > > Zoran Regvart
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Claus Ibsen
> > > -----------------
> > > http://davsclaus.com @davsclaus
> > > Camel in Action 2: https://www.manning.com/ibsen2
> >
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > ------------------------
> > Guillaume Nodet
> >
>
>
> --
> ------------------------
> Guillaume Nodet
>
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Alex Dettinger
+1

On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 4:33 PM Andrea Cosentino <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Ah sorry, for the misunderstanding, yeah we're saying the same thing.
>
> Il giorno mer 12 giu 2019 alle ore 16:32 Guillaume Nodet <
> [hidden email]>
> ha scritto:
>
> > I was referring to the "Today with org.apache.camel, then we know all of
> > that is the official Apache Camel." sentence which implies that if the
> > groupId isn't org.apache.camel, it may not be official.  I slightly
> > disagree, as I think anything that *starts with* org.apache.camel is
> > supposed to be official so that would cover org.apache.camel.spring.boot
> or
> > anything similar.
> >
> > Le mer. 12 juin 2019 à 16:11, Andrea Cosentino
> > <[hidden email]> a écrit :
> >
> > > It's just a different package naming.. It's
> org.apache.camel.spring.boot
> > >
> > > --
> > > Andrea Cosentino
> > > ----------------------------------
> > > Apache Camel PMC Chair
> > > Apache Karaf Committer
> > > Apache Servicemix PMC Member
> > > Email: [hidden email]
> > > Twitter: @oscerd2
> > > Github: oscerd
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Wednesday, June 12, 2019, 4:02:25 PM GMT+2, Guillaume Nodet <
> > > [hidden email]> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Anything that starts with org.apache.xxx should be released by the
> > > corresponding Apache project.
> > > If that's not the case for Camel, we should ask the other projects to
> > > change their groupId to something not starting with org.apache.camel.
> > >
> > > Le mer. 12 juin 2019 à 12:24, Claus Ibsen <[hidden email]> a
> > écrit
> > > :
> > >
> > > > Hi
> > > >
> > > > Well then we have camel-spring-boot itself, its not a starter should
> > > > it then also have that group id or not?
> > > > Today with org.apache.camel, then we know all of that is the official
> > > > Apache Camel.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]>
> > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > Hi Cameleers,
> > > > > we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> > > > > `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them
> > with
> > > > > another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
> > > > >
> > > > > My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of
> > starters,
> > > > > even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some
> versioning
> > > > > information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> > > > > this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly
> mutually
> > > > > exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
> > > > >
> > > > > What do you think?
> > > > >
> > > > > zoran
> > > > > --
> > > > > Zoran Regvart
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Claus Ibsen
> > > > -----------------
> > > > http://davsclaus.com @davsclaus
> > > > Camel in Action 2: https://www.manning.com/ibsen2
> > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > ------------------------
> > > Guillaume Nodet
> > >
> >
> >
> > --
> > ------------------------
> > Guillaume Nodet
> >
>
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Gregor Zurowski-2
In reply to this post by Zoran Regvart-2
+1

On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Hi Cameleers,
> we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
>
> My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
>
> What do you think?
>
> zoran
> --
> Zoran Regvart
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Onder SEZGIN
+1

On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 9:00 AM Gregor Zurowski <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> +1
>
> On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Cameleers,
> > we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> > `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> > another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
> >
> > My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> > even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> > information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> > this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> > exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > zoran
> > --
> > Zoran Regvart
>
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Zoran Regvart-2
In reply to this post by Zoran Regvart-2
Hi Cameleers,
from what I read, seems like there are no objections in doing this,
I've created an issue[1] and I can work on this for the next
milestone.

Any thoughts on what the new group ID would be? I was thinking
`org.apache.camel.spring.boot` seems pretty self explanitory. To have
it exactly match what it is. I would not include the version (so not
`org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`), as starters we have might not have
any issues running on future Spring Boot versions, and perhaps adding
versioning would be a decision we can make when we need to.

zoran

[1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CAMEL-13643

On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Hi Cameleers,
> we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
>
> My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
>
> What do you think?
>
> zoran
> --
> Zoran Regvart



--
Zoran Regvart
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Andrea Cosentino-2
org.apache.camel.spring.boot sounds good to me.

--
Andrea Cosentino 
----------------------------------
Apache Camel PMC Chair
Apache Karaf Committer
Apache Servicemix PMC Member
Email: [hidden email]
Twitter: @oscerd2
Github: oscerd






On Thursday, June 13, 2019, 1:32:53 PM GMT+2, Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]> wrote:





Hi Cameleers,
from what I read, seems like there are no objections in doing this,
I've created an issue[1] and I can work on this for the next
milestone.

Any thoughts on what the new group ID would be? I was thinking
`org.apache.camel.spring.boot` seems pretty self explanitory. To have
it exactly match what it is. I would not include the version (so not
`org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`), as starters we have might not have
any issues running on future Spring Boot versions, and perhaps adding
versioning would be a decision we can make when we need to.

zoran

[1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CAMEL-13643

On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Hi Cameleers,
> we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
>
> My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
>
> What do you think?
>
> zoran
> --
> Zoran Regvart



--
Zoran Regvart
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Gregor Zurowski-2
In reply to this post by Zoran Regvart-2
Agree, we can add versions when we actually need them.

org.apache.camel.spring.boot seems fine.

Thanks,
Gregor

On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 1:32 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Hi Cameleers,
> from what I read, seems like there are no objections in doing this,
> I've created an issue[1] and I can work on this for the next
> milestone.
>
> Any thoughts on what the new group ID would be? I was thinking
> `org.apache.camel.spring.boot` seems pretty self explanitory. To have
> it exactly match what it is. I would not include the version (so not
> `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`), as starters we have might not have
> any issues running on future Spring Boot versions, and perhaps adding
> versioning would be a decision we can make when we need to.
>
> zoran
>
> [1] https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/CAMEL-13643
>
> On Wed, Jun 12, 2019 at 12:08 PM Zoran Regvart <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Cameleers,
> > we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> > `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> > another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
> >
> > My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> > even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> > information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> > this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> > exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > zoran
> > --
> > Zoran Regvart
>
>
>
> --
> Zoran Regvart
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Peter Palaga
In reply to this post by Zoran Regvart-2
Hi Zoran,

as far as I can understand, moving the Spring Boot starters to a
separate git repository is not a part of this plan, right?

If so, I tend to think this is not a good idea. Here is why:

1. Having a 1:1:1 relationship between release cycle, groupId and git
repository seems to be the most common practice in the maven world.

Following common practices is an advantage on its own because it saves
time by not requiring to learn any local peculiarities.

Sticking with the practice of having 1:1:1 between release cycle,
groupId and git repository, allows the projects depending on Camel to
check that they manage the right version of our artifacts: if all
artifacts of one groupId (and nothing else) refer to the same
${camel.version} property, all is fine. But once you break the 1:1:1 in
some way, the versions management becomes a hell of nitty-gritty details
that even may change over time.

2. If this is going to lead to a situation in which we'll have the same
artifact id in multiple groupIds (something like
org.apache.camel.spring.boot1:starter-1 and
org.apache.camel.spring.boot2:starter-1) then Eclipse users (including
me) are going to stop liking you. Eclipse requires manual hacks in
situations like that. Having a different artifactId is much more painless.

Thanks,

-- Peter

On 12/06/2019 12:08, Zoran Regvart wrote:

> Hi Cameleers,
> we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
>
> My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
>
> What do you think?
>
> zoran
>

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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Andrea Cosentino-3
Hello Peter,

We can do this until we are under heavy development like we are now on
Camel 3.

The groupId won't change anymore once we release 3.0.0 final release. This
is why we are discussing this now.

For the second question, there is no plan to split and support multiple
different starters for different SB version. That was only a pour parler
about possible scenarios.

We can eventually think about it later, if it will be the case.

Moving to a different repository the Spring Boot starters is not part of
this discussion, because it's not something straightforward.

Cheers.

Il giorno gio 13 giu 2019 alle ore 16:35 Peter Palaga <[hidden email]>
ha scritto:

> Hi Zoran,
>
> as far as I can understand, moving the Spring Boot starters to a
> separate git repository is not a part of this plan, right?
>
> If so, I tend to think this is not a good idea. Here is why:
>
> 1. Having a 1:1:1 relationship between release cycle, groupId and git
> repository seems to be the most common practice in the maven world.
>
> Following common practices is an advantage on its own because it saves
> time by not requiring to learn any local peculiarities.
>
> Sticking with the practice of having 1:1:1 between release cycle,
> groupId and git repository, allows the projects depending on Camel to
> check that they manage the right version of our artifacts: if all
> artifacts of one groupId (and nothing else) refer to the same
> ${camel.version} property, all is fine. But once you break the 1:1:1 in
> some way, the versions management becomes a hell of nitty-gritty details
> that even may change over time.
>
> 2. If this is going to lead to a situation in which we'll have the same
> artifact id in multiple groupIds (something like
> org.apache.camel.spring.boot1:starter-1 and
> org.apache.camel.spring.boot2:starter-1) then Eclipse users (including
> me) are going to stop liking you. Eclipse requires manual hacks in
> situations like that. Having a different artifactId is much more painless.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -- Peter
>
> On 12/06/2019 12:08, Zoran Regvart wrote:
> > Hi Cameleers,
> > we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> > `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> > another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
> >
> > My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> > even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> > information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> > this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> > exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > zoran
> >
>
>
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Peter Palaga
Thanks, Andrea, for the clarification.

Given what you said, what are once again the benefits changing the
groupId of the SB starters?

By breaking the 1:1:1 relationship between release cycle, groupId and
git repository, we will cause confusion and migration costs on the side
of the users and there certainly should exist benefits that outweight those.

Thanks,

-- Peter

On 13/06/2019 16:40, Andrea Cosentino wrote:

> Hello Peter,
>
> We can do this until we are under heavy development like we are now on
> Camel 3.
>
> The groupId won't change anymore once we release 3.0.0 final release. This
> is why we are discussing this now.
>
> For the second question, there is no plan to split and support multiple
> different starters for different SB version. That was only a pour parler
> about possible scenarios.
>
> We can eventually think about it later, if it will be the case.
>
> Moving to a different repository the Spring Boot starters is not part of
> this discussion, because it's not something straightforward.
>
> Cheers.
>
> Il giorno gio 13 giu 2019 alle ore 16:35 Peter Palaga <[hidden email]>
> ha scritto:
>
>> Hi Zoran,
>>
>> as far as I can understand, moving the Spring Boot starters to a
>> separate git repository is not a part of this plan, right?
>>
>> If so, I tend to think this is not a good idea. Here is why:
>>
>> 1. Having a 1:1:1 relationship between release cycle, groupId and git
>> repository seems to be the most common practice in the maven world.
>>
>> Following common practices is an advantage on its own because it saves
>> time by not requiring to learn any local peculiarities.
>>
>> Sticking with the practice of having 1:1:1 between release cycle,
>> groupId and git repository, allows the projects depending on Camel to
>> check that they manage the right version of our artifacts: if all
>> artifacts of one groupId (and nothing else) refer to the same
>> ${camel.version} property, all is fine. But once you break the 1:1:1 in
>> some way, the versions management becomes a hell of nitty-gritty details
>> that even may change over time.
>>
>> 2. If this is going to lead to a situation in which we'll have the same
>> artifact id in multiple groupIds (something like
>> org.apache.camel.spring.boot1:starter-1 and
>> org.apache.camel.spring.boot2:starter-1) then Eclipse users (including
>> me) are going to stop liking you. Eclipse requires manual hacks in
>> situations like that. Having a different artifactId is much more painless.
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> -- Peter
>>
>> On 12/06/2019 12:08, Zoran Regvart wrote:
>>> Hi Cameleers,
>>> we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
>>> `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
>>> another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
>>>
>>> My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
>>> even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
>>> information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
>>> this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
>>> exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
>>>
>>> What do you think?
>>>
>>> zoran
>>>
>>
>>
>

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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Andrea Cosentino-3
The benefits are in what Zoran described in the starting email.

There will be anyway a migration effort for the end users once they'll pass
to Camel 3.

I believe we are limiting the migration effort already, changing a groupId
of a starter is not a big problem and it doesn't add too much effort on the
end users.

This is not confusion. This is what happens when you pass through a major
upgrade. The milestone release we released are just litte step through the
final release.

You need to consider the migration from 2.x to 3.x and there will be a bit
of migration effort already for the end users.

Il giorno gio 13 giu 2019 alle ore 16:56 Peter Palaga <[hidden email]>
ha scritto:

> Thanks, Andrea, for the clarification.
>
> Given what you said, what are once again the benefits changing the
> groupId of the SB starters?
>
> By breaking the 1:1:1 relationship between release cycle, groupId and
> git repository, we will cause confusion and migration costs on the side
> of the users and there certainly should exist benefits that outweight
> those.
>
> Thanks,
>
> -- Peter
>
> On 13/06/2019 16:40, Andrea Cosentino wrote:
> > Hello Peter,
> >
> > We can do this until we are under heavy development like we are now on
> > Camel 3.
> >
> > The groupId won't change anymore once we release 3.0.0 final release.
> This
> > is why we are discussing this now.
> >
> > For the second question, there is no plan to split and support multiple
> > different starters for different SB version. That was only a pour parler
> > about possible scenarios.
> >
> > We can eventually think about it later, if it will be the case.
> >
> > Moving to a different repository the Spring Boot starters is not part of
> > this discussion, because it's not something straightforward.
> >
> > Cheers.
> >
> > Il giorno gio 13 giu 2019 alle ore 16:35 Peter Palaga <
> [hidden email]>
> > ha scritto:
> >
> >> Hi Zoran,
> >>
> >> as far as I can understand, moving the Spring Boot starters to a
> >> separate git repository is not a part of this plan, right?
> >>
> >> If so, I tend to think this is not a good idea. Here is why:
> >>
> >> 1. Having a 1:1:1 relationship between release cycle, groupId and git
> >> repository seems to be the most common practice in the maven world.
> >>
> >> Following common practices is an advantage on its own because it saves
> >> time by not requiring to learn any local peculiarities.
> >>
> >> Sticking with the practice of having 1:1:1 between release cycle,
> >> groupId and git repository, allows the projects depending on Camel to
> >> check that they manage the right version of our artifacts: if all
> >> artifacts of one groupId (and nothing else) refer to the same
> >> ${camel.version} property, all is fine. But once you break the 1:1:1 in
> >> some way, the versions management becomes a hell of nitty-gritty details
> >> that even may change over time.
> >>
> >> 2. If this is going to lead to a situation in which we'll have the same
> >> artifact id in multiple groupIds (something like
> >> org.apache.camel.spring.boot1:starter-1 and
> >> org.apache.camel.spring.boot2:starter-1) then Eclipse users (including
> >> me) are going to stop liking you. Eclipse requires manual hacks in
> >> situations like that. Having a different artifactId is much more
> painless.
> >>
> >> Thanks,
> >>
> >> -- Peter
> >>
> >> On 12/06/2019 12:08, Zoran Regvart wrote:
> >>> Hi Cameleers,
> >>> we publish Spring Boot starters with the Maven group ID of
> >>> `org.apache.camel`, I think it would be better if we publish them with
> >>> another group ID, something like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot`.
> >>>
> >>> My reasoning is that with time there might be other kinds of starters,
> >>> even within the Spring ecosystem, we might event add some versioning
> >>> information in the group ID, like `org.apache.camel.spring.boot2`,
> >>> this might open the doors for supporting multiple (possibly mutually
> >>> exclusive) versions of Spring Boot.
> >>>
> >>> What do you think?
> >>>
> >>> zoran
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >
>
>
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Zoran Regvart-2
In reply to this post by Peter Palaga
Hi Peter,

thank you for your feedback :)

On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 4:29 PM Peter Palaga <[hidden email]> wrote:
> as far as I can understand, moving the Spring Boot starters to a
> separate git repository is not a part of this plan, right?

No, we can't do that easily, starters are generated from component
code, having this across two repositories would make this more
complicated.

> If so, I tend to think this is not a good idea. Here is why:
>
> 1. Having a 1:1:1 relationship between release cycle, groupId and git
> repository seems to be the most common practice in the maven world.
>
> Following common practices is an advantage on its own because it saves
> time by not requiring to learn any local peculiarities.
>
> Sticking with the practice of having 1:1:1 between release cycle,
> groupId and git repository, allows the projects depending on Camel to
> check that they manage the right version of our artifacts: if all
> artifacts of one groupId (and nothing else) refer to the same
> ${camel.version} property, all is fine. But once you break the 1:1:1 in
> some way, the versions management becomes a hell of nitty-gritty details
> that even may change over time.

We're discussing changing just the group ID, we're not discussing
having a separate release cycle or separate version for the starters.
Can you elaborate on how the version management would get more
difficult, perhaps there's something I'm not aware of?

> 2. If this is going to lead to a situation in which we'll have the same
> artifact id in multiple groupIds (something like
> org.apache.camel.spring.boot1:starter-1 and
> org.apache.camel.spring.boot2:starter-1) then Eclipse users (including
> me) are going to stop liking you. Eclipse requires manual hacks in
> situations like that. Having a different artifactId is much more painless.

That's another reason to go with `org.apache.camel.spring.boot` as the
group ID, do you see any issues with that in Eclipse?

zoran
--
Zoran Regvart
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Re: [DISCUSS] Changing the Maven group ID for Spring Boot starters

Zoran Regvart-2
In reply to this post by Peter Palaga
Hi Peter (again) :)

On Thu, Jun 13, 2019 at 4:56 PM Peter Palaga <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Given what you said, what are once again the benefits changing the
> groupId of the SB starters?

I've touched upon some of the benefits in my original e-mail[1], in
short I think that having a separate namespace allows us some leeway
in the future for having different kinds of starters. I was mostly
prompted by this with the issue we had when we moved from supporting
Spring Boot 1.5.x to supporting Spring Boot 2.x, if we had a separate
namespace then, we could have had the possibility of supporting both
versions, there were other reasons why this would be difficult, but
not having separate namespace was one of them.

I would like to have this option in the future, and doing this in
Camel 3.x when we're allowing some breaking changes feels like the
right moment to do it.

> By breaking the 1:1:1 relationship between release cycle, groupId and
> git repository, we will cause confusion and migration costs on the side
> of the users and there certainly should exist benefits that outweight those.

I know of several git repositories that release from one Maven graph
with different group IDs, and I contribute to some of them, I've never
experienced this issue, perhaps you can provide an example to make it
a bit more clearer for me to reason about this?

zoran

[1] https://mail-archives.apache.org/mod_mbox/camel-dev/201906.mbox/%3CCABD_Zr8z_iyw8O9o3xdNibkDwJa3ExzAj2RRSZu2hXag7MQumw%40mail.gmail.com%3E

--
Zoran Regvart
12